Are you familiar with how the social justice system works, specifically for public defenders? In this episode, Julia Lazareck speaks with Jessica Smith-Peterson, Deputy Public Defender at the Clark County Public Defender’s Office in Nevada. Jessica takes us through the ins and outs of the job, explaining when a public defender is assigned and what their role entails. Recalling her personal experiences, she also shares how she’s helped clients through various cases. If you’ve ever wondered what a public defender does, stay tuned because there are so many questions that will be answered in today’s podcast!
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First-Hand Information On Being A Public Defender With Jessica Smith-Peterson
We have a special guest who is a public defender with the Clark County Public Defender’s Office. I have spoken to many people who did not know whether to hire an attorney or to use a public defender. It’s a financial and emotional choice for your loved one. There are so many questions that will be answered in this episode. Questions like, when is the public defender assigned? What does a public defender do?
Let me introduce Jessica Smith-Peterson, who’s a Deputy Public Defender at the Clark County Public Defender’s Office and has been there for a few years. She’s passionate about social justice, providing quality representation to clients, and voting rights for previously convicted persons. Jessica, thank you so much for being here. I appreciate you taking the time to talk to us.
Thank you for having me. It is an absolute pleasure to be able to explain what we do as public defenders and to provide this information to your audience.
There are so many questions. Let’s start with the first one. Can you tell us when a public defender has been assigned?
In the state of Nevada, there are two main hearings. When an individual is first arrested, they go through within 48 hours to 72 hours. An initial arraignment hearing is where we discuss bail and custody release. A public defender is appointed for the limited purpose of addressing bail and addressing custody status. If they are not at that initial arraignment hearing, they will go to a subsequent hearing in their department, which is where their case is formally filed.
Once they got to that department, the judge on the bench asked them questions about their custody status. They ask them whether or not they are able to afford or hire an attorney. If they are not, then one will be appointed to them that morning. You have a public defender that is appointed to you, either for the limited purpose of your bail or your custody status or you will see them at another hearing in which the judge will formally read you the charges against you. As well as formally appoint a public defender to represent you in your case if you cannot afford to hire an attorney.
At that time, when the person is in front of the judge or at the arraignment, is there a public defender there ready to talk to them, or are they brought back to the facility and make an appointment to see the public defender?
There is a deputy in every courtroom that individual will go to. A public defender will be there to discuss either releasing them. They talk about what they are charged with briefly. They explain to them the protocol, the next steps, and whether or not they are going to go forward with a preliminary hearing. It’s a quick process, but it does provide the individual in custody with the information they need.
Especially if they need to get information from family or someone on the outside about what’s happening with their case. There’s always going to be someone to talk to them either about their preliminary hearing or their custody status or if this is a situation where they want to enter into a negotiation that morning if one is provided to them. A public defender is also there to explain the consequences of that plea.
Right away, they can talk to a public defender. Could you extrapolate more about what a public defender does?
A public defender is an attorney. Oftentimes, you will be going to hire private counsel. You are going to get a public defender. The only main difference between the two is that the family or the individual who was in custody is not required to pay us. We are there to represent our clients at every moment and stage of their criminal proceedings without any cost to them. As we are there for the bail or the initial arraignment, you will have a public defender who was there for a preliminary hearing.
You will have them there for any motions that need to be filed. If your case goes all the way to trial, then you will have two public defenders at that point at your trial arguing against the state trying to secure a not guilty verdict. If that does not happen, then we also have an appellate team that takes over your appellate case. You have an institution that is with you from when you are initially arrested all the way to an appeal if it gets that far.
A public defender is appointed for the limited purpose of addressing bail and addressing custody status. Share on XIf somebody is convicted and they are incarcerated, does the relationship continue, or at that time, does it cease?
The relationship with the public defender that completed the trial up until the sentencing is when they are given their sentence. If they are sentenced to a term of incarceration or sentenced to a term of probation, that is when it ends. If, for example, it’s a term of incarceration, but there were appellate that came up during the trial. The attorney that was originally signed to the trial case will give all of the information to their appellate team member. The appellate team will take over and handle that as well.
Somebody that does get a public defender is fortunate because you have the same training and schooling as a paid attorney.
Yes, we still go to law school. We still have to do our three years of law school. We still must sit and pass the bar exam for the state in which we are practicing. For me, it would be in the State of Nevada. We have a team of people that we work with. We have over 100 public defenders. In the adult office, we have juvenile public defenders. We have an appellate team. We have a team specifically that handles murder cases. The team that specifically handles sexual assault cases.
You have the remaining attorneys handling cases as small as trespass to as high as attempted murder. We also have social workers to help with any substance abuse, mental health issues or gambling, diversion program application assistance, or veterans court application assistance to make sure that you receive the full representation that you should receive.
That’s wonderful that all that support is out there. I know that you have had a lot of options. Why did you decide to be a public defender?
I knew in law school that I always wanted to help people. The great thing about laws is that there are various ways in which you can help people but also, it can get overwhelming. I knew I did not want to do property or family law, but I was generally gravitating toward criminal law. Being a public defender allows me to hone my skills as a trial attorney but also help people who could not afford those skills or the resources and the services for them being indigent. It felt like a very natural place for me to be. I have been here for about a few years and it’s been a journey.
I commend you. I know we have spoken several times. I know that you are very passionate about social justice and helping people. I think that they are very fortunate to have you. One of the other questions I have is about how do you handle the workload? I have heard that the public defenders can have a pretty high workload.
This is true. This is something that we shy from. As with anything, it comes and goes and waves. For me, it’s about time management, how we balance our various cases, and how to remember status checks. It’s amazing. We have secretaries who pull out our calendars every week, so we can at least see what we have going forward the week prior for the next following week. When it comes down to deadlines, we make sure that we are up to date on our own calendars. We are getting information from the clerk of the court on when things are filed, like transcripts from hearings, so that we can prepare accordingly.
When it comes down to balancing all of the clients that we may have, we do consider clients in custody whose liberties are being withheld. Meaning they are not out of custody. They are not with their families. They are serving time or have been in custody at the detention center or in prison. We try to make sure that we focus on what we can best do to resolve their case or move forward with their case. We have our clients who are out of custody who will call us for status checks.
We try to make sure that we give that to our secretaries or make sure that we are answering them to the best of our ability. We know that they also need to be taken care of, but it is about balancing clients who are in custody versus our clients who are out of custody. Using our teams with our social workers and secretaries to make sure that we are all sharing part of the load, to make sure that is being represented is done so to the best of our ability.
You spoke to me about communication and how important that is. Keeping communication with the person that you are representing is important.
Very important. We get phone calls. They can either go to us or the front desk then they are rerouted to us. Making sure we take note of who’s calling when they are calling. We are getting calls from several people, Not only clients but clients’ families. We also want to ensure that if the family members who were calling that we do have the permission of our clients’ permission, we are able to talk to them about their case because of our own duty of loyalty to our clients. We want to ensure that these lines of communication are open and that they understand what is happening and how we are moving and going forward with their case.
Any ideas that they have in regards to what they want to do and how they want to resolve it. As we are counselors, we are attorneys, we are advising them on what we are provided in terms of their case, of discovery, what the law says and how it is written and how it’s supplied to ensure that there is a full understanding of where they are in the criminal proceeding. A lot of communication and talking. Talking with clients, court, or state. It’s a key component of our job.
I love the way you are explaining things. You make it so clear and easy for people to understand. I appreciate that. I did have another question about the types of people that can get a public defender. Are there certain requirements?
They do take into account your financial situation. When you are brought into custody, you go through a booking process and that is at the jail or detention center. When you are brought to the court and given the charges or the formal charges against you, they also give you paperwork to determine, “Do you have a job or do you work? How much money do you make? Do you receive any government assistance? If so, what do you receive? How much do you receive?”
The court essentially does a breakdown of, “This is how much money you would get. This is the threshold for having a public defender appointed to you.” Once that determination is made, then we can formerly be appointed to that individual or if this is a situation where the prosecutors or the state are not seeking jail time, which is called a liberty interest.
You have a right to be free. If they are not seeking jail time in that case, then we are not appointed to you because we defend liberties for other people. We defend an individual’s right to be free. If they are not seeking that, then oftentimes, they may have to hire their own private counsel or seek an organization that takes misdemeanor matters, which are usually the matters where they may not seek jail time so that they could have representation.
When somebody gets arrested within so many hours, let’s say, 24 to 72 hours. They will go before the judge to be arraigned. At that time, it will be determined whether they are able to get a public defender. If they are, the public defender or somebody will be there to meet with them and walk them through the process, so they don’t have to figure it out alone. A public defender like yourself will work with that person through the process, trials, or hearings. If they are incarcerated or there are reasons for appeals, then they would be handed to another group that handles the appeals.
That is correct.
A public defender defends an individual's right to be free. Share on XI get a lot of questions, especially with Prison Families Alliance, which supports families. Somebody will call that their loved one was arrested and they are like, “I want to see if I can get a public defender. Can I call the Public Defender’s Office?” My understanding is that there’s nothing they can do until the person’s arraigned. Is that true?
That is correct. Say if someone were arrested now, we are not going to be assigned to them until maybe the next day. We don’t handle that case. They are also going through a booking process. They are being fingerprinted. Their information is being uploaded. They are taking pictures. They may be housed in a particular area. Only when they get to court and are initially arraigned is when we truly come into play.
Thank you so much for providing all the information that you have so far. I think I’m getting it and we’ll be able to help other people that have these questions. Could you walk us through a scenario of somebody that you have helped?
I can tell you that I have varying levels of clients, some as young as fifteen and in their late-‘70s. I had a young man who came into custody on, say, a drug possession charge. At an initial arraignment, he was appointed to the public defender. I was not the individual who made the argument for his custody, but I was the one who was subsequently appointed for his preliminary hearing.
A preliminary hearing is not the same as a trial, but I do explain to clients that it’s very similar to a trial. Witnesses may show up. They will get on the stand. They testify under oath but instead of a jury being present or you being found guilty or not guilty. It’s a way for a judge to know, 1) Whether a crime was committed. 2) Whether that defendant was the one that may have committed the crime.
Sometimes cases can get dismissed at a preliminary hearing, but 99% of the time, they don’t. They get what’s called bound over for trial, but prior to us getting to a preliminary hearing, you can also negotiate your case. In two scenarios and that one, there was a case where my client, who was charged with possession of a controlled substance, wanted to negotiate this case instead of going to trial or instead of having the witnesses come in and testify and the officer on the stand. He made a choice to accept a negotiation, but one in which we modify would result in a dismissal.
Even though negotiations may drop from their original felony charges to say a misdemeanor drug conviction. It’s still a misdemeanor drug conviction, especially for someone who’s young. It was focused on doing community service and taking a drug class and making sure that they stay out of trouble and don’t get arrested.
My client explained that he was going through a tough time and that he was very remorseful but very thankful that he was given the opportunity to essentially go about his life without having a conviction. He did the community service. He did not get arrested again. He stayed out of trouble and he successfully completed the low-level drug counseling class. Now, his case was dismissed instead of having the misdemeanor drug conviction on his record. He can seal it and he can go about wanting to go to school or getting any funding if he wants to do so, but he is not going to go through this life with that drug conviction on his record.
For me, especially as it relates to my passion for voting rights and even for formerly convicted people to get back into the community and vote. I’m always excited when there’s someone who does not have their life, either put on pause or become severely derailed because of a substance abuse issue or something that has affected them because of whatever they have gone through in their life. They can go forward, vote, get housing, and go to school. That has been a win.
On the other hand, I have had clients charged with theft crimes, but it took from a preliminary hearing to filing several motions to a three-day jury trial for that client to be found not guilty. That is from the initial arraignment up until a jury trial, which spanned, I believe, over six months. I was able to get the resolution that exonerated my client because he was not guilty. I still get calls from him to this day thanking me and being very appreciative of what we did for him.
I think that those two situations are ones that I carry with me a lot because this work is not easy. It is extremely difficult because you see the good and the bad in everybody. If you are trying to come to a conclusion about how do you best help this person? How do I best help the person that I am defending? What skills and tools do I need? Who do I need to reach out to?
This is great because I’m in an office where I could go to the appellate team and ask questions. I can go to the murder team and ask questions. I can go to the head of the office and ask questions about my particular issue to help one person and then we do it all over again. We do it from initial arraignment to maybe trial to negotiations to sentencings to maybe even appeals. We win some and lose some and we still get up and do this day after day.
It’s so good to hear from you because a lot of people don’t understand what a public defender does and you have explained it well. Also, put a light on all of the good things you are doing, all of the people you are helping, and the care and compassion you have. I don’t know if everybody realizes that public defenders have a choice. They can do other things. They can go into private practice and open their own practice but it takes a special person to be a public defender. I want to thank you for all that you are doing.
It’s so important because there’s so much that we don’t know. The other thing that I wanted to ask about is families. When we were talking offline, you said that if a family comes to an arraignment, you can talk to them and get information about the person you are defending. Maybe they need medication or something that they could bring to light?
For example, someone is at the initial arraignment and the family shows up. Even if the deputy in the courtroom is not the assigned deputy, you at least know that there is a family member there to support them. We oftentimes ask our clients first whether or not we have permission to talk to their family or whomever there supporting them about their case so that it’s very clear that they are in support of them.
Oftentimes, they give us information that we may or would not have received but for speaking with them. Not only do we talk to our clients and try to get them to explain the situations what they are going through, but we also speak to families to get a sense of some things that may be missing from the narrative or from the story.
It’s wonderful that you have that communication with the family. I wonder, does the family have aligned to you? I could think that it could be a little abusive possibly.
It could be at times. I’m not going to lie to you, but yes. It could sometimes be. Our focus is on our clients. We are representing them. It’s in our title. We are defenders. We are defending your loved one. We always want to ensure that we are focused on the clients and how we are defending them and making sure that we are in constant communication with them. I know that they are oftentimes family members who want updates every day.
Sometimes, because the law is the way it is, it does not move as quickly as we would like it to. That includes if they are very serious cases with very serious charges. There are investigations, discoveries, and motions. There are a lot of factors in play. Families do call and we do have conversations with them. We still focus more on our clients and make sure that they have all the information they need.
I still think it gives a family member comfort knowing that they can talk to you and call when it’s important. You are not there to give them daily updates, but if they have a question, they have somebody they can reach out to. I think that’s helpful for the family. It’s like anything else. You are doing your job and if a family member needs something or wants to share information with you or if you have a question that could help your client, you folks have that relationship and communication. I did not realize that you had that. Thank you for sharing that.
This work is not easy. It is extremely difficult because you see the good and the bad in everybody. Share on XNo problems. I have a lot of families that call me.
It’s a real level of comfort. When I talk, especially to parents who are worried about their child, I know that there’s somebody that’s protecting them. As you said, defending them. I think that’s helpful.
I had a mother call me on a direct line. I’m like, “How is it going? How can I help you? Everything’s going to be okay.” To give her some peace.
You wear several hats.
A lot of hats.
If somebody needs a social worker, at what point are they assigned?
Depending on the case. If this is a situation where, for example, substance abuse is involved or there are mental health diagnoses that they may have had or have not had. We have an amazing social work team that works with the attorneys in our office and tries to help get us information. For example, if there is an individual who is in custody, who’s not taking medication but should be taking medication. We tried to ensure that we connect with our social workers to receive the proper dosage of what they need, then follow up with clients to make sure that that’s happening.
They are one of my favorite groups of people in the office. I’m sure they love and hate me because of the last social work requests. They help us balance and oftentimes humanize our clients because they are in custody for various severe charges. We are in this position where they are being judged by one of their worst X. Our social workers help in bringing to light who they are, then helping us defend them to the best of our ability.
It is something that we say, “It’s what they did, not who they are.” I love hearing that they are humanizing them because we are all people. We are all human beings. We leave that to see people as people. It’s that somebody did something that they should not have. I know I have done a few things, so we got to have compassion and empathy for everybody. I’m here with Jessica Smith-Peterson. She’s the Deputy Public Defender of the Clark County Public Defender’s Office. What we have spoken about in this episode pertains to Clark County, Nevada. Laws might be different in other counties and other states.
Yes. With each public defender, we take different exams with each office because oftentimes, we have different laws. There are different structures and how their public defender offices are formulated. For us, everything that I have spoken about it relates to our public defender office, what we have, and how it has been litigated over the years. Making sure we bring people within 24 to 72 hours that they have an attorney who is assigned to them at initial arraignment.
They have an attorney assigned to them for bail hearings within those 24 to 72 hours. We have attorneys who are working seven days a week in this office. They are sometimes on Fridays, Saturdays, and Sundays to make sure that their loved ones are seen and taken care of. That lingering in custody for several days without having spoken to anyone.
If we did not have this conversation and all the information that you provided. How could somebody get this information outside of this show? How would they have found out what they could do here locally which would help people in other jurisdictions? How can they research it?
If there are organizations like this one that have connections with public defenders, that would be one. There are grassroots and organizers who typically deal with incarcerated and formerly incarcerated individuals who have been in contact with our Public Defender’s Office, or it would be going to your Public Defender’s Office. There is usually a front desk for you to speak to someone to figure out what the process is? How does this work?
If you are in another jurisdiction and maybe it’s not as accessible in terms of like physically going to the office, then oftentimes maybe they have a website. If not, they will have a phone number somewhere someplace you will be able to figure out what your public defender’s office in your jurisdiction does. If you are in a situation where you or a loved one are in custody and you find yourself in court, then you will come into contact with us.
I think that’s a good place to end it. I want to thank you. As Jessica was saying, if you need to find information about a public defender in your jurisdiction, there are organizations in your area that you can find on the website. You can call your local Public Defender’s Office and they can provide you with information on the process. You can also visit us at PrisonTheHiddenSentence.com. If you have any questions or comments. Jessica, thank you again for your time. Are there any last words that you want to leave the audience with?
Love your public defenders. We are working very hard. Although we are not getting paid by families, we cannot accept gifts. We do enjoy thank yous. We appreciate them. Not that we need them because we don’t get into this work wanting them but we do appreciate them.
I’m going to give you a big thank you right here. Thank you so much.
Thanks, Julia.
Important Links
- Clark County Public Defender’s Office
- Prison Families Alliance
- PrisonTheHiddenSentence.com
- https://www.Linkedin.com/in/jnspeterson/
- https://www.Facebook.com/hiddensentence
About Jessica Smith-Peterson
Jessica Smith-Peterson is a Deputy Public Defender at the Clark County Public Defender’s Office in Las Vegas, Nevada. In her work as a public defender, Jessica zealously advocates on behalf of indigent defendants accused of misdemeanor and felony charges. She is a former national student board member of the American Constitution Society (ACS) and member of the local Las Vegas lawyer chapter, an executive board member of the National Urban League Young Professionals (NULYP) and serves on the alumni council for Young People For (YP4), a national social justice incubator for college aged people through People for the American Way.
Prior to being at the Public Defender’s office, Jessica was a Corps Member in City Year, DC, and a law clerk for the ACLU of Nevada. While at the ACLU, Jessica taught formerly convicted persons how to restore their voting rights in Nevada and worked closely on an impact litigation lawsuit on behalf of indigent clients receiving poor legal representation in rural Nevada. Jessica has moderated and participated on panels and podcasts concerning criminal justice reform and Knowing Your Rights.
She has written op-eds piece focusing on Supreme Court confirmation hearings in the Nevada Independent as well as the Nevada Lawyer calling for the reallocation of funds from Police Departments. Jessica has served as a legal observer with the National Lawyers Guild Las Vegas chapter and also serves as an inaugural steering committee member leading virtual teach-ins on policing in Nevada. Jessica is a graduate of Howard University School of Law and the University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA).
albert ortiz says
Jessica’s saved my life…I cannot be More Greatful for Her…She is Definitely anointed and God blessed…