Gail Dennis On How She Used Her Voice To Help Neglected Children

 

What happens to the family left behind by people who are incarcerated? Most importantly, what happens to their children? The Court Appointed Special Advocate (CASA) Foundation is a program that supports children that have been neglected, abused, and are in foster care. Gail Dennis, CASA volunteer and Toastmasters speaker, sits down with Julia Lazareck and talks about how CASA has not only changed the lives of young kids in the system but also her own. She shares her story and how her hidden sentence has led her to a life of service. 

—

Listen to the podcast here:

Gail Dennis On How She Used Her Voice To Help Neglected Children

I am here with Gail Dennis, who has volunteered for many organizations and has realized that the organizations and people she’s helped are based on her brother’s past. She is a passionate speaker and talks about the importance of how people are treated and especially children. Gail, thank you so much for being here. I appreciate it. 

Thank you for having me. 

I would like to start with what you shared with me after my Toastmaster’s presentation about my brother’s incarceration and what you realized after that. 

When you were giving your presentation and as I sat there looking at you, you mentioned the hidden sentence that people are living, it hit me. I thought, “That’s me.” I’m living the hidden sentence because when my brother was arrested and he ended up in court, I sat there thinking that legal aid was going to speak up for my brother but he did not. He didn’t say anything. When my brother went to prison, two years later, going through the prison journey with him every weekend, you start to think about things but then, life does go on at a certain point. 

When I heard you giving that presentation, it took me way back. I said, “I’m living that hidden sentence.” When I started taking classes at CSN, there were about the law. I ended up volunteering for Metro in the Juvenile Justice Department for missing juveniles. I did that for a while. For several years, I volunteered at the municipal court. After listening to you, I realized that I went in that direction because of what happened to my brother. I don’t know which way I would have gone but that was the way I went due to what I went through and was holding on about my brother and didn’t realize it. After volunteering for the municipal court for several years, they had offered me a position down there but it was part-time and I needed a full-time position, so I said, “No.” 

There’s a lot of good in you. You just have to find a way to get it out. Share on X

Here I am. I am working in the trucking industry. One day, I picked up the phone to make a phone call and the phone call was to the CASA office. It wasn’t deliberately to the CASA office. It was a mistake in the phone call. I dialed the wrong number. When the lady explained that it was the CASA office, I asked her, “What’s that?” She went on to tell me that if I came down to watch a short video, I could decide whether I wanted to volunteer with them. I went down to watch the video and I thought, “I can do this.” I can help some kids that some of their parents are going through the prison system.  

The CASA Program is a Court-Appointed Special Advocate for children that have been neglected and abused and are in foster care. What the CASA Program does is you are given a case file and that’s your case. You visit the child, know the child and find out everything about that child. Everything that has that kid’s name on it, you have access to. You do this all on your time. You can visit the school to see how the child is doing a school and the doctor’s visits. Every six months, you write a court report about the child. 

You do different things with the kid to get to know the kid and see what you can do to help this child with whatever needs that the kid needs. It’s a very rewarding thing because when you meet these kids, they’re not sure whether they can trust you or whether they even like you. Your job is to keep working and talking to that kid so that you can get a breakthrough. Once you get a breakthrough with that kid, it’s amazing how that kid starts talking and tells you everything they’re going through. When they feel like they can get comfortable and trust you, they let it go. That’s when you can offer the best for that kid. 

One thing that I like to do with the kids is to pick out things that they do well. One of my kids that in the case file when I read it, I thought this kid was a monster. I called the caseworker and I said to her, “Am I going to need some backup here when I go meet this kid?” I go down to meet this kid and the caseworker, first of all, told me that the kid is not going to let me speak. She’s going to curse at me and on and on. I get down there and I introduced myself to this kid. The kid is not saying a word. I’m sitting there thinking, “Do I have the right kid?” She hasn’t said a word. Let me ask her a question. I said, “What do you think about what I said?” She said, “I like it,” and then she paused. I said, “What do I do next?” That comes along with getting to know the kid. Let me ask her a question. I said, “Why don’t you introduce yourself to me? Tell me a little bit about you.” She blurted out a few words and I was still confused, of course. 

I would always tell her when I was going to come back because I wanted her to know that I was going to show up. When I came back to the third visit, she walked me to the door. I said, “You want to walk me to the door?” She said, “Yes.” I said, “Let’s go.” We got to the door and I said, “Can I give you a hug?” She just fell on me. I felt the weight of this kid. I said, “No kid should go through this.” I said to her, “You wanted to walk me to the door. That is the good in you. That’s in you. There is a lot of good in there. We got to find a way to get to that.” These kids start molding into what they are going through in life. It’s so quick how people will say, “That’s a bad kid.” Let us go over here, talk to this kid and hear his journey because everybody has good in them. 

This young lady from that file until the day that she aged out. First of all, I would take her to lunch. I would take her to good places and then one day, I took her to Crystal Palace so that she could go roller skate. I was having a back problem at the time. She didn’t want to go roller skate unless I went with her. That is amazing. I said, “No, my back.” She said, “No, we can go slow.” I said, “Okay.” When we first got to the roller rink, she asked the guy, “Do you have any openings?” I said, “Look at you, trying to get a job here.” 

 

These are the things that touch my heart and we have in us to offer, not just kids but other people. Our journey may not have been what we wanted it to be because my journey certainly was not but I had to make a change because I wanted to make a difference in this world. I have two kids. They’re grown. When I leave this earth and my kids would say, “My mom tried to make a difference.” This kid, she aged out. The bad thing about when the kid ages out, sometimes they don’t know where else to go, other than the same area that they came from. One of the things I would like to work on is what do we do with these kids once they age out because we want to keep them going in the good direction that they were gone in when they aged out of the system. I feel like these kids are the ones that are losing here and they didn’t ask to be put in this situation. 

Supporting kids is so important especially for a lot of the kids that you’re helping that have incarcerated parents and are put into the system. Support for children, for adults, for everybody is so important and you help that one and you’ve helped others. That’s so important. I wanted to touch on your youth. How you grew up and why you’re so passionate about it? If you can share some of that because a lot of what you do is because of your experience and what you went through. You have the depth to help others and kids because of what you went through. 

When I was a little girl, I was the second oldest of five kids at the time. The reason why I say at the time was that when I turned sixteen, my mother had another kid. When she had the five, she used to leave us at home a lot and she would tell me to watch the other kids. She was on welfare at the time and sometimes, she wouldn’t come home for like a day or so. We had no food. My older brother and I would look through the trash cans trying to find things that we could sell to get some money to get some food. The thing about it is my mother, when she would get her welfare checks, would go out with her friends and leave us at home. When she would come home and something was wrong, like if something were broken and she would want to find out who broke it. She would get two extension cards and go to beat these kids. I would jump in the middle and try to stop her and I ended up getting the most of it all the time. 

Just thinking back on that, how it was one night that she left us at home and we were hungry. When I got up, I said, “I’m going to find something.” There was nothing in the refrigerator but six eggs. I got up and said, “I’m going to fix these eggs for these kids.” I went to light the stove. I blew the match out. I threw it in the trashcan. The match in the middle was still lit so the trashcan went up in flames. It was by the window and it caught the curtains. Somebody called the Fire Department and it burned the window up. My mother comes running in the door and I told her, “I was trying to feed the kids.” 

Sometimes you do things to people or say certain things and don't realize that you’ve made some type of contribution to this person's life. Share on X

She said, “You want to mess with fire?” She turned the stove on and put my hand in the fire. She made me sleep in the kitchen over one of the chairs. That situation stayed with me for years. I said, “Here I was taking care of her kids and that is what I got in return.” I wasn’t the oldest at the time but I sure act like I was the oldest. She would tell me all the time that my father raped her. I didn’t know my father. I never met the guy. She would tell me that he raped her and didn’t want to have anything to do with her. She didn’t want to have anything to do with me. For so many years, I used to cry at night for a long time because I could not figure it out. 

I said, “Like a cute little girl, such as myself, why wouldn’t somebody care about me?” That bothered me for a long time. My mother is a person that is not a loving person. Every child needs to know that their parents love them. I have a daughter and a son but my daughter was first. When I had my daughter, I didn’t want a daughter because I lived in New York and there were so many women on drugs. When I had my daughter, my mind went right back to New York to seeing those women on drugs in the street and doing any and everything to get more drugs. It was a couple of years when my daughter would come to hug me and I would gradually push her away because I didn’t know how to love somebody. I didn’t know how to let my kid know that I cared about her. I didn’t know anything about that because it was never done to me. 

One day I was thinking, I don’t want my daughter to feel how I felt. I used to drink at that time because I was trying to numb myself. I didn’t realize it at the time. I realized that when I was in a support group. One of the ladies said something about her drinking to numb herself and I was like, “That’s me.” I had to change how I treated my daughter. That’s why one of the things I don’t understand. If something hurts you, why would you do it to somebody else? I didn’t want my daughter to feel that way so I had to learn how to take that kid, hug her and let her know, “You got a mom and your mom loves you.” Both my kids, that’s the best thing that ever happened to my life because it made me realize that I got to think about somebody else other than myself. 

I got to think about my kids and do what I can to let them know that I am here for them. “You are wanted.” When I talk about my kids to my mother, it bothers her. It’s weird but it bothers her. My mother, I may have hugged her twice in my lifetime. She came out here when I was in my 50s and I was getting ready to wash my hair. She said, “Do you want me to wash it for you?” She’s my mother and I was terrified because I said, “She’s got to touch me and I’m not used to her touching me.” I put my head over in the water, she went to put on the shampoo and I jumped. It terrified me. As I’ve gotten older, I do what I can for her but I can’t find love in my heart for her. That’s sad to say but it’s the truth because I don’t want my kids to say, “I don’t love my mom.” They tell me that they love me all the time. 

Gail, I think you take that love and you give it to others. Everything that you’re doing you volunteer. You volunteer with Metro, helping with the missing kids, working at the municipal court, what you’re doing with CASA and also what you’re doing now with the support group that you have. A group of kids who have incarcerated loved ones and family members and you meet with them monthly. Those are the kids that are 5 to 10 years old and you’re doing great things and helping them. All kids need support and these kids that have incarcerated parents are going through a lot. They need to feel like it’s not their fault and everything and you’re doing that. 

I wanted to say, “You’re putting the love out there in the world.” Maybe it is not for your mom because of what you’ve been through or maybe you’ve been through what you’ve been through so that now you can have the love pouring out of you to be helping all these people. I appreciate it. I’d like you to share the story about the girl that couldn’t talk and how you found your voice. The people who are reading about you now think that you’ve been talking your whole life but because of what you’ve been through, you didn’t have a voice. If you could tell that story, it is powerful. 

Several years ago, I was very afraid of speaking. When I was in school, I had a speech for five years. When I would get out in public, I would freeze. I was very shy at the time and had a hard time speaking to people. I picked up the phone to make that phone call and I dialed the wrong number. That’s funny how things work in your life. 

To CASA. Yeah, it was meant to be. 

I was calling another somewhere. I picked up the phone when the lady said, “CASA,” I know CASA as in Spanish for home. When she said that and I said, “What is CASA? What do you mean by that? She said, “It’s a Court-Appointed Special Advocate for children that have been neglected and abused and that are in foster care.” She said, “If you want to learn more about the program, you can come down and we can show you a short video and you can make a decision whether you want to get involved in that.” 

The funny thing about that is while we were going through the military, we used to take care of this kid. At the time when we met this kid, he was about two and a half. He called me, this was a couple of years later and he was about 14 or 15. I happened to tell him about that phone call to the CASA office. He said to me, “Gail, you’ve always been a mentor to me.” I said, “What?” He goes, “Yeah.” This was a kid who was 14 or 15 and so when I hung up from the phone with him, I said, “Heck, I might as well go down here and find out about this program.” 

A lot of times, we do things to people or say certain things. We don’t realize that we had made some type of contribution to this person’s life. I went down and looked at the video and to tell you the truth, I still was terrified of speaking. I have no clue what made me say, “I’ll go ahead and volunteer. I had no clue what made me do that.” They interviewed me and so they said, “Now you have to go through a background check,” and then you have to do, at that time, it was a 40-hour training, which was broken up into several days. 

When I went through the training and you have a little graduation. At the end of that, they hand you this case file. When I looked through the case file and then I said, “To point when I have to go and meet the kid.” This kid had multiple disabilities and she was non-verbal. It said some things to me but when I saw this kid and what the kid was doing in the room. She did not realize that we were in the room with her. I said, “I got to help this kid.” I had no idea what I was going to do. The foster mom at the time was a nurse, the caseworker was there and all this stuff that they were talking about this case. I was terrified because I said, “I have no idea what they’re talking about because it was mostly legal and medical.” When I kept looking at that little girl and I said, “I can’t turn my back on this kid.” I have to learn about this. That meant that I had to open my mouth. I didn’t know how I was going to do that. Until that day, I was in Nellis Air Force Base Commissary. There was one small little booklet on the counter and I snatched it up on my way out the door. 

 

That night when I was looking through that booklet and I saw that Toastmasters article and I didn’t know what Toastmasters meant but I read the article and I thought, “This may help me out.” I didn’t know if it was going to help me out but I figured I’d give it a shot. I’m going to be honest, that first speech, which was about myself, my icebreaker, is what is so important about Toastmasters. It’s the support because it was a very small club and we were in an office room. The way they clapped gave me that boost and support to know that I could speak at that first meeting. I was so excited. I had so much energy. I ran out of there straight to my daughter’s house to talk about that speech. 

As I kept going to my meetings, it finally opened my mouth. That’s what gave me the strength to speak up for this little girl. She is now adopted into a great home. When I met her, she was ten when she moved into this home. She had been through several homes but she didn’t know how to use the restroom on her own until she moved into this home. They showed her how to eat. I walked in there a week later, one evening, to see how things were going. She was sitting at the table with a fork and she was feeding herself, which she didn’t know how to do before she got there. 

On her eighteenth birthday, I don’t know how it ended up turning out that way but they adopted her. They take good care of this kid. When I would go over there, they had pictures everywhere of this kid. When I first met this kid, she would not even smile. She would barely look at you but now in her life, after she moved in with his family, she smiles all the time. I told her, “All I see is your teeth.” I know that she is in good hands. I knew that that week after I walked in and I saw her sitting at that table feeding herself.  

What changed her life was that day in court when you saw that you had to be the voice that changed both of you. 

She could not speak. I feel bad saying this because I was thinking that, “Gail, if you didn’t go through Toastmasters, what would you have said for this kid? I don’t know.” Being that I had gone through Toastmasters and this attorney said, “Your honor, we have exhausted all of our resources.” She had never met the kid. The change for me was that I saw and knew the kid and for her to say that we’ve exhausted all of our resources. She knew that we needed help for medical help for this kid, for her to say that and for me to say, “I’m about to do something that I have never done,” and that’s when I jumped in and I said, “That is not exactly correct.” I went on to explain to the judge what the story was. These are the little things that give you that boost. The judge said, “I agree with you 110%.” 

My CASA supervisor was sitting behind me. She leaned up to look at my face as if to say, “I can’t believe that came out of your mouth.” When I go down there nowadays and they’ll say something like, “Yeah, I can’t believe this is the one that we couldn’t get a ride out of.” It all turned out hopefully the way it should have. I told him and I said, “It was you guys. It’s your fault because you gave me the case.” I said, “Now you can’t shut me up but it’s all for a good cause.” 

People have to find their voice. They need to be able to talk about it. Share on X

You found your voice. People have to find their voice. They need to be able to talk about it. That’s why we have support groups and we do what we do. I wanted to go back to talk about the hidden sentence a little bit because when your brother was incarcerated and you visited, didn’t you hide it for many years? It wasn’t until you were older that you realized how it affected you because you were stuffing it for so many years or it was like in the background. 

If I could remember, I don’t believe I ever talked about it to anyone. I never said much about it to my mother. I don’t remember my mother ever visiting my brother. It was something that it stayed in my head and I don’t remember discussing this with anybody as far as I can remember. We weren’t very smart. I didn’t learn how to read until I was in my twenties after I had my kids. The only reason why I had pushed for that was that I had to help my kids. I didn’t want them to be in the same situation that I was in. 

What helped me learn how to read was there was a commercial on TV about a tape to teach you how to read. I ordered the tape and it said, if you were not 100% satisfied, you could send it back. I couldn’t afford the tape. The tape was $20 something and I couldn’t even afford that. I ordered the tape and it helped me learn how to read. I sent the tape back and I said, “I wasn’t 100% satisfied,” but I lied that bothered me for years, too. What I did about that was when I started working, I would go to the store, Barnes & Nobles and get these gift cards for either $5 or $6. When I started working at this job and we would have like picnics with the kids, I would have them do something or whoever won in the game or whatever, I would give them these gift cards because that was my way of paying back for that tape. 

I said, “If I give this kid this gift card, this is $5 or $6 that their parents don’t have to put out if they take them to the store to get a book that they wanted.” They get to select the book because, more than likely, they’re going to read that book. I wanted to help somebody else learn how to read. I did that for a long time. When we stopped having the picnics or whatever activities, I took a bunch of those coupons down to a radio station, Power 88 and I gave it to them. I said, “When those kids do well on their report cards or whatever, give them one of these cards.” 

I felt like because it bothered me when I did that and I just wanted to give back. I wanted to help a kid. Sometimes I say, “I feel life has slapped me crazy,” because it was different things that kept coming to my life. It wasn’t good and so I am able to see some things now. I can’t stop a person from going through certain things in life because whatever is on your journey for you, that’s on you. Maybe if you came in contact with me, it would be a little different, a little easier. I don’t know.  

Did you also do a talk at Metro? 

 

I did. I gave a speech at Metro and I was very nervous but I knew I was going to do it. I put race in the speech but the speech wasn’t about race. It was about love. I did that speech in Seattle also. Before I did that speech at Metro, here I am in a meeting with them and it was a Toastmasters Club they had. I’m looking at some of the big, burly detectives in there and you’re thinking, “What are they going to think about this speech?” 

As I was standing up front giving this speech, I was saying to myself, “It is quiet in here and they are listening.” The funny part about it was the biggest burly guy in the room. He gets up and hits up in the chest. He said, “Gail, you grabbed my heart.” I wanted to give that speech to them because they interact with all races, cultures, nationalities or whichever way you want to put it but I wanted to give them something to think about because all people are not bad. Everybody that gets into trouble, they’re not bad people. It depends on what you go through on your journey. 

Hopefully, those people that learn that speech in that room that day saw things a little differently. When I would run it to them, they’re like, “Gail, are you speaking later?” I say, “No.” It made me feel good because it touched them. That is why I gave that speech to them because I wanted it to touch somebody. The funny thing about it is it was very quiet so I was surprised that I even reached out to them and their club to find out if I can come and give that speech. I said, “You did that. You couldn’t get a lot out of me.” 

You’ve come a long way. You’ve given back so much and now there’s going to be a Toastmasters Club for family members who have a loved one that’s incarcerated or has been incarcerated, as well as returning citizens, people that are coming out of prison and so you’re a catalyst on that. It’s something we’re working on together and you’re going to be the president of that club. Talk about giving back. 

That is a great opportunity for me because we’re dealing with people involved with the prison system in one way or another whether they were a child and now they’re adults, whatever the case may be. The reason why I am so glad that I am involved in this that everybody deserves a second chance. Sometimes people need a third chance but they are human beings and things have been done to them that have changed their lives. A lot of them have never experienced somebody coming along and being kind to them. 

If I can come along and encourage you to show you something that maybe you’ve never experienced, to give you and your life another shot to do good then I want to have something to do with that. People are in situations where they do things that I’m sure they are sitting back saying, “I can’t believe I did that.” You did so what are we going to do from here? I remember a guy and I said to him, “I want a better job.” He said, “Gail, it’s not going to come to you. You got to go get it.” 

I feel like whoever joins this club, we are going to give them as much support as we can. I want them to know, “There are good things out there. There are good things in you. We got to find a way to pull it out of you. I want to be there to help do that, to help support these people and for them to go on and do something good with their life.” The beauty of this is, I tell people certain things are like a tree. You help this one branch on the tree and it spreads out. When I am speaking at work about diversity and I said, “The good things that you learn in here, you’re like a tree. You’re going to spread out. You’re going to take it to your family and your friends and hopefully, it’s going to get out there but that depends on you.” Some people are going through things that are hard and some of them are going to say, “I don’t believe you. I don’t trust you.” Whatever the case may be but they’re going to walk away with those thoughts in their head. Hopefully, they’re going to turn around. They’re going to know, “It’s up to me.” 

It’s so funny because I was in another support group for anxiety after my sister passed away. This lady was holding on to some things that happened to her when she was a child and I asked her one question. She just started crying. I didn’t say anything. A lot of times, when people do that, I let them go through the motion. Two weeks later, when we had another meeting, she walks in the door. I was sitting in the room already and so when she came through the door, I was looking and I said, “Is that so-and-so?” She was all dressed up and she comes over to me. She said, “Gail, I want to say thank you.” I nodded my head and I left it at that but that is the thing that changes people’s lives. You are being kind, you may have asked a question or have given them some information. There have been many people that came into my life and that’s why I am where I am now. 

A lot of times when people would say certain things to me and they care, it surprises me a little bit because I didn’t have a lot of that. That’s something that I cherish because I still go through things about why didn’t my mother care about me. I have to find other things to fulfill that. My way of fulfilling that is to care about someone else, to let that person know, “You have worth. You are worthy. If I can help you get through something, let’s get through it so that you can go on live in your life.” That is why I do what I do. As I do what I do, I learn more about people, techniques and questions to ask a person. I keep going. 

I look forward to continuing this journey and the new group that we’re starting with Toastmasters and other things that we’ll be doing, growing the kid’s groups, kids that have incarcerated family members. Gail, what you have been through growing up, everything that you’ve been through, your brother’s incarceration and loss have made you the beautiful, loving person that you are now. I want to thank you. 

Everybody that gets into trouble is not a bad person. It depends on what people go through on their journey.  Share on X

You’re welcome. I want to thank you for giving me a shot at the children’s group. What I, at this point, would like to get out of that is to get the kids to feel comfortable enough for them to sit and tell me what they want to tell me and get them talking. Going through this journey and Toastmasters, what I realized is what helped heal me was the talking. You got to talk about it. 

Talk about it with safe people in a safe environment. 

Some people you can’t talk about your stuff with because sometimes you’ll walk away feeling worse than when you first opened your mouth. You got to know that person. That is crucial right there. I feel like if we can start with the kids and let them know, “You have worth and I understand you’re going through a struggle but let’s talk about it.” 

That’ll keep them from getting into the prison system too, as they’ll have their self-confidence, their support and everything. 

Thank you. 

—

I want to take a minute to tell you about the Prison: The Hidden Sentence book. There are so many things that you need to know when a loved one is taken into the prison system that nobody tells you. This book will provide valuable information to help you through the stages of the prison system with your loved one. I also share stories so you know that you’re not going through this alone. You can purchase your copy of Prison: The Hidden Sentence book on Amazon. 

Important Links: 

• Gail Dennis 
• CASA 
• https://www.Toastmasters.org/  
• https://TheFFIP.org  
• https://prisonthehiddensentence.com 

About Gail Dennis

Gail Dennis has been in the trucking business for many years but her heart is in helping our youth. She is a CASA (Court Appointed Special Advocate) volunteer for children that have been neglected and abused. She has volunteered for Metro in the Missing Juvenile Department and Municipal Court in the Pre-trial Department. Gail is involved with Toastmasters International to improve her communication skills. She is also on the Diversity Council at work and does several community events to help others.

• Here’s How »

• https://prisonthehiddensentence.com/
• LinkedIn
• Twitter
• Facebook